blather
the_rebel_alliance_3
Dafremen see also:
THE_REBEL_ALLIANCE
THE_REBEL_ALLIANCE_2

Seer, spork, screwing_for_virginity, stork_daddy, anyone else that's motivated and trying to participate constructively, I apologize for doing this again, just thought that distractions were getting things off track again. Probably another reason why we should come up with an alternative to blather for communicating, organizing and mobilizing this thing. You have my email address, please contact me, I'm looking forward to it. I'll also start working on an alternative chat site unless you folks don't think it's necessary or unless someone else would like to take care of that.

Again, my intention is NOT to take charge or assume leadership or anything...just to be helpful and keep things rolling. Feel free to jump in at any time. (With my having no permanent internet connection at the moment, it would probably be better if someone else DID.) 		021212
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[.:..The SeeR ..:.] Dafreman... Quoting you from the_rebel_alliance_2

"The things we are doing need to be presented as a way of living, a micro-society. Not a religion, but a movement. Many people NEED to feel part of a greater whole in order to do what they would find undoable as individuals. I think we need to get organized, get a platform of some sort that we can all agree on and then MOVE! The time is right, as you mentioned before. If we are established as a group, and maintain our motivation, history will provide the catalyst for change that a movement such as ours requires. As long as our motives remain pure and our goals continue to be pursued with an eye toward a better future, we'll be ready for that opportunity and for the momentum that it will provide for social evolution. "

You NAILED it! Excellently stated! I feel exactly the same way. And about the micro-society: Some of the things we've brought up seem borderline "cult-ish", and I think it's wise to steer clear from that sort of thing.

I have long desired a break-away from this failing society, as do most people who can forsee it's seemingly inevitable collapse, Like Rome's, from the inside. Of course I still think it's possible to revolutionize... (and who better to do it than us blatherskites?)
But here is the problem that I keep coming up with:

If we all, for instance, moved to Saskatchewan and formed a commune, or whatever, a micro-society designed to promote reasonable ethics, humane living in a balanced environment, and solid priniciples of education and righteousness, for example, we would
a) Be unable to reach out and help the masses regain political control
b) lack the resources to build the future the way they should be building it right now,
and c) only be helping ourselves and our decenants, which is a selfish act.
Plus all the drama associated with breaking away from society... I think this IS a plausible scenario if one of two things happend, either a major nuclear/economic attack against americans, causing collapse of government, etc... or the failure of the revolution and worsening oppression of Americans until it's unthinkable to stay... If any of those happens, I am moving to Saskatchewan to become a Hemp Farmer!




p.s. I do think we need a better place to continue these discussions... but not email...
hmmm 		021212
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[.:..The SeeR ..:.] www.FearBush.Com may be it...

Also check out www.UnAmerican.Com

(Thanks MollyCule!) 		021212
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??????? Yes, Seer, please go to that website. Because any site that makes a levelheaded, sober comparison between Bush and Hitler is appropriate for you. Unlike this site, which occasionally breeds dissent, you will find at that website all the pandering, overblown rhetoric necessary to nurse your sense of persecution and satiate your thirst for crazy-ass paranoia.

Honestly, now, that Bush site--THAT's what the New Renaissance is about?? Cheap conspiracy theory bullshit is the basis of The Seer's Big Important Revolution? That's just motherfucking sad.

Oh shit, I might have ruined this one, too. Better start again at "The_Rebel_Alliance_4:_There's_a_radio_receiver_in_my_dentalwork". 		021212
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stork daddy me motivated? nah...nevermind, i have nothing to say. 021212
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screwing for virginity im thinking i must agree with the question marks on this one. sites such as unamerican.com are simply there for a) someone to make a buck, b) that same persons stress releif (and probably anyone who visits) and c) just to be cute. if you want a serious edge, unamerican is not the way to go.

i havent checked out the other site yet, but it sounds like the same sort of thing. 		021212
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screwing for virginity i was wrong. fearbush.com does look like it is more than someplace to go to and whine and get stickers. 021212
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??????? Well think about this, Screwing: The site is not fair. Once again, I don't support Bush, but that site can't possibly be considered a fair assessment of the issues or public sentiment, because it's set-up as an anti-Bush site. The domain name itself, the ready-made Bush-bashing topics, etc. There are Bush supporters who post there, but they seem to be in the vast minority. Now, is this because the disenfranchised or otherwise non-voting masses don't like Bush, or is it because the FearBush.com proprieters are clearly biased, and the site's setup is subsequently off-putting to Bush policy supporters? If you had a Site called IHateDirtyJews.com, do you really think it could be considered a fair forum, or that it could help you to accurately assess anit-semitic feeling in the US?

Also, the most popular thread seems to be an extended analogy of Bush to Hitler. These people are serious. As dumb as Bush is, he's not anything close to Hitler. That's just plain stupid, and that sort of insanely misguided rhetoric doesn't really help anyone or any cause, worthy or not.

And although protesting a president is a valid form of civic expression, it's hardly a Massive Political Revolution or a Paradigm Shift or--stupidest of all--a New Renaissance. 		021212
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??????? Basically, I think The Seer is trying to create a gratifying "revolution" by artificially stitching together dissimilar issues that would be better dealt with separately. Like I said before, protesting a president is not a political revolution, and adding enough other stuff to such a protest to make it seem "revolutionary" enough to fit the definition is adolescent and irresponsible. 021212
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[.:..The SeeR ..:.] Yeah S_F_V_, The FearBush.com site would be better... But I read some of the things the "whiner" was saying and it sounded familiar... the basic recognition that a change is needed NOW! So I figured it was at least worth mentioning. Plus...that site is how I found the fearBush.com site. 021213
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Dafremen Ok, first off. When I say Micro society..I mean like THIS. Blather is a micro-society. It is separate from society, buts its members also interact with society as parts of that society. Although the whole commune thing sounds great to me too, it's also not financially feasible for any of us (I'm assuming) nor is it necessarily desirable for all of us that desire change. Also, as you said, I'm not about to turn my back on the people who need and deserve change. THat would be selfish of me. I don't know about Unbush.com or whatever...I just grabbed a signmyguestbook.com guestbook and I thought it could be used as an unoffical chat room for us. The nice thing about it is that we can edit it and it's only fair that several members be given access to do that. If that doesn't sound like something you folks wanna do, let's hear some alternatives. I'm not sure who brought up CULTS again, but this has nothing to do with a cult. I'm an average every day father of four with a lovely family, a decent job (now) and a lot going for me in life. I have no desire to form a cult. I want to be a part of a movement...as I said, I micro-society that grows within society. Basically just people that feel it's time for a change and that have agreed to support certain agreed upon principles in their daily lives in order to bring about that change. It's that simple. I've already started talking to people. I started the day after I posted TAKING_IT_TO_THE_STREETS. I'm helping the homeless when I can afford to, talking to normal everyday folks like you and me about whatever comes up and when the conversational mood seems appropriate I ask them about how they feel about things like the way things are changing, whether for the better or for the worse. I ask them how they feel about the world and whether they think its dangerous or whether they feel that the media has been exaggerating too much. Etc Etc. I'm working on T-Shirts, currently based on the Daffy_Nation idea, because at this point we haven't DONE anything and I'm tired of waiting. I'm certainly willing to change that logo, so long as I know that we've got at least a serious chance at creating a group that will last and that will actually do something. I have a history of starting groups that LAST. That's because we avoid things like leadership positions and HUGE rulebooks and go with the simple ideas of democracy and open forum discussion. One group has been around for 3 years and doesn't look to be going away anytime soon, the second has been around for a year and is helping people learn English as a second language along with promoting literacy. I'm moving on this revolution thing...if yer ready...let me know. I've got an email address dafremen@hotmail.com, you're free to use it. Once we have a definite YES to doing this thing and a definite idea of what it is that we're going to do, everything else should be a piece of cake. A lot of work, but a piece of cake. Lemme know. 021218
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Dafremen Oh, and one more thing:

I do NOT necessarily disagree with all of your political views, however I think that taking the political route is a losing proposition that will only serve to polarize people either for us or against us. It is this Machiavellian syndrome that has been the thorn in the side of most movements. You can't unite the majority of people in a common cause if you speak out against the politics of half of them. I believe that there are common symptoms to the sickness that pervades society that can be presented in a manner that any rational person Democrat, Republican or Communist can agree on. If I'm right, and if you folks agree and add similar ideas to the pot, this thing stands a really good chance of catching on. If we go the tried and true route of fist waving and student rabble-rousing then we are doomed to repeat not just their successes, but their failures as well. Although those types of movements tend to meet with a certain amount of success, it is limited in its scope and its appeal. Although there is a certain amount of immediate gratification to watching a small group grow quickly, the growth tends to be short term as the competition for discontented radicals is fierce out there. We need a different, more palatable angle, one that appeals to even those who aren't screaming for change, but rather just whining for it..or only thinking about it. 		021218
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Dafremen Hope that isn't all. I was hoping for so much more. Brings up another down side to going after the angry ones. What happens when the anger subsides? 021227
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Dafremen Apparently...that WAS all.

Well then, Daffy_Nation it is.

Seer, Spork, Virginity...if you need me I'll still be out there taking_it_to_the_streets.

Haven't you heard? America_is_going_to_hell . 		021230
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dB The last thing we need is another wako (spelling?), even a small online one.
Daf is right to say take it to the streets. That's where the people are, and we aren't winning them over or promoting a political opinion, we are simply talking and encoraging thought which is enough.
Thinking about the election turn out shows you how much america really cares about itself as a democracy, just like world affairs don't interest them unless it's about someone coming to kill them or someone they are going to kill.

If you can encourage enough people to think about other people and the whole_world, maybe they'll put the bit of paper in the box and change things how they want them. Maybe change the political system in the states a little because it's simply a joke at the moment (to other countries at least).
whatever happens, at least people are doing something, and you are helping them see that they can do something.

Or, you buy someone a cup of coffee and pay them a compliment and that person feels better about themselves for a short while.
Either way, it's worth the $2.50. 		030114
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Dafremen Somehow Db, it figures that you would get it, man. Yes, it's the little things that open doors and close gaps. Yes indeed. 030215
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dB Daffy, I want you to run for president.
Please do so. I'll even become an american citizen so I can vote fo you. 		030219
what's it to you? blather
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