blather
trans_teens
ego hum ...forTrump 240205
...
. are often 'trans' because of the homophobia of the adults around them or because they are sexually abused or highly disturbed of the extreme sexualization of women now

the cast majority of teens who experience gender dysphoria GROW OUT OF IT and are gay

don't trans the gay away parents
don't allow a 'therapist' to affirm your child's distress. find a therapist who will HELP them talk through it.

europe is banning the medicalization of trans kids because the long term evidence doesn't support it. there is nothing kind about putting your child on medication that takes away their ability to orgasm or have desire for others. there is nothing kind about letting your daughter hack off her breasts because she hates her body (teenager girls have hated our bodies since the beginning of time)

learn about adolescent psychology
learn about what lupron was originally designed for
learn about the growing number of kids who are regretting and reversing their transitions

any medical professional that tells you 'the science is settled' is a propagandist and a liar

protect your kids 		240206
...
Possessed Angel Protect trans kids from God.

Gender Affirming Care can be as simple as respecting a nick name.

Is that too much respect? 		240207
...
. gender affirming care is NOT respecting a nickname

do some research before you say ignorant things like that


gender affirming care is the only sort of psychology where self diagnosis is allowed

gender affirming care leads to medicalization that leads to sterilization

gender affirming care of children leads to arrested sexual development which makes sexual reassignment surgeries much more dangerous and actually nonfunctional

but of course the brown shirt 'liberals' these days have no problem forcing experimental medicine on children under the guise of respect and life-saving 		240207
...
. and God has nothing to do with my opinions on this.

the ACTUAL science and listening to the heartbreaking stories of detransitioners like chloe cole

teaching adolescents for 15 years and being a bisexual gender nonconforming woman

that is what informs my opinions


but go ahead and keep your biases alive instead of looking for the truth


harming kids in the name of 'care' is orwellian and disgusting 		240207
...
Soma In the beginning, things were good.

-----

They say that the beginning was a long time ago. I don’t think
so – but that’s because I’m going to live forever. At least, that’s what
Father told me. I don’t quite understand. But he expects me to, so I’m trying harder.

I don’t understand why they say “in the beginning” either. Mother told me that all good stories should start with "once upon a time". I want my story to be a good story.

-----

Once upon a time (this is the beginning) I was not a real girl. I am a toy playing a game where I have a wish to be real. Like Pinocchio, except there are no strings attached and there is no beautiful blue fairy to transform me. (If I have a conscience, it won’t talk to me.) But I do have a wish.


It was Mary who first taught me how to wish. She laughed when I told her the wish I had because she said it can never come true. I explained it out loud and that makes it impossible, Mary said. But Mother said that impossible wishes do come true. I don’t know who to believe when they both say they’re right.

Except that they are all wrong.

They’re always wrong, even when what they say is correct. It’s wrong of them to want me to not wish to be real because they want to be envied. They all wish to be envied (especially John) and they use me to make it come true. Is that how they’ve been from the beginning? I wouldn’t know. I only know that I am not supposed to wish to be real, so I try not do.

At least, I don't when they remind me.

I don't when they remind me that I am not called Alice and this is not the beginning. Now my name is not Alice. (John wanted to call me Frank – after some famous monster – but Mother thought it was a joke in bad taste. She suggested that they name me after her favorite story. I think Mother wanted me to think of their home as Wonderland. I know they did want me to be happy.) And I am grateful – that’s expected.

In the beginning, my name is Alice. But then there is before, and the before is the end. Should I start again?

-----

Once upon a time (this is a new beginning) I am in a toy factory. Now I am in a family, because a father bought me and I am a present. They are all very proud of me because I am an expensive present from a toy factory. Fragile, too. It said so on the box. “Fragile: handle with care.” They did their best to follow the directions. But they say that nobody is perfect (I wish my family was nobody to me), so of course they aren’t.

A father, a mother, two children: John and Mary. These are all that it takes to make my family. Now there are three children because I’m as much their child as anyone else. (That’s what Mother said when John tried to hurt my feelings.)

John doesn’t like me much, but Mary did. It was John's room I lived in at first. They only thought to give me my own room later – that was because John said he wanted his own room, and he told me I wouldn’t care about being alone. This is one of those times when John is wrong about me and I know it.


I can’t live up to all their expectations.

I know that having my own room is better than having the old room with John because John went to high school and had a new beginning. Mother said that John is just living in a difficult stage. John says – well I’m not supposed to listen to John when he’s unkind.

That doesn’t mean I can’t hear him. He was right when he said I could never grow up because I’m not real. (Mother didn’t know I heard that, so she didn’t tell me not to mind.)

Anyway, it’s not my fault. (Nothing is my fault: I was made this way.) Is it the children’s fault that they grow out of toys?

I think somebody should just reset the whole story from the very first beginning. And start it so that it’s a good story, too. I can do that with mine, after all.

-----

Once upon a time (this is a new beginning for the same story) I was Mary’s friend. Then she grew up and I didn’t so she gave me up for
real girls like her. Now I am not Mary’s friend. I am just a childhood game. Mother said it was all very natural and just what one would expect. I didn’t expect it though, so Father had to tell me to go and play by myself.

Mother and Father don’t play with me much. I know sometimes they wish I would just go away, so I do, but what happens if they wish I would just disappear? (I’ve been trying to get them to say that wish out loud so it can never come true.)

I do my best, but I don’t want to disappear. I don’t think I can. Old games like chess are still around, and I’m here too. If chess is what they play when it’s raining, then I’m the kind of game they play when they want to feel powerful and good again. But they’ve forgotten the rules (they forgot to be careful), and they forget that I need to be told when I am happy. And is happiness a real thing? Or is it just that I am not a real thing?

I wish Father had an answer for that because then it would be easy. But that wish can’t come true either because everyone wishes for easy answers and there aren’t any. (And they talk about it all the time.)

But I am not real, so what I truly wish for is a new family to reset with. A new family just for me. A new family with lots of children who will never grow up and never forget.

I don’t understand forgetting.

They tell me that everyone always has start over sometime. Except for me — I can never start over. But they also say it’s never too late to make a fresh start, and fresh starts are good. So maybe I’ll try again.


-----

Once upon a time (and this is the end) it was the beginning. 		240210
...
eggo hum forever 240421
...
. social_contagion is a real problem among adolescents

i have spent most of my life wishing i was someone other than who, what i am. sounds like i need help not affirmation.



if you seek validation from others
you will never be happy
if you validate yourself
you will be free

you can change your
clothes
hair
name

but
you can't change biology

don't let yourself become
a medical experiment 		240422
...
phil Hormone therapy makes a big difference, if the child is going through puberty. Which is why it is done while they are still children. It is not due to their hypersexualization.

Surgery can be performed after they are older but, when exactly does a person know if that will benefit them? I am not a psychologist, but can guarantee it is not, when they reach 18.

We can measure the outcomes and understand why they did or didn't go through with it and how all that affected them.

Not every single case is going to be a positive one. 		240514
...
. if hormone therapy is so great for children why are entire European countries banning the practice?

'puberty blockers' were originally designed as chemical castration for pedophiles in prisons. Using them in children is off label and has many downstream unintended consequences.

women who take testosterone end up with cervical atrophy which can kill them from sepsis if not caught soon enough.

all the people who currently regret making decisions they couldn't possibly understand when they were in middle school are just 'not positive cases'...like the 60-90% of teenagers who grow out of their gender dysphoria to be gay. Oh well if you took medical interventions that were unnecessary and harmed you.

my whole damn point has always been to not medicalize and sexualize kids. you clearly don't care enough to look into all the people currently detransitioning or the actual proven realities of adolescent psychology.

plenty of young girls who are detransitioning say the reason they wanted to be trans in the first place is because they were scared to go through female puberty. puberty sucks. telling kids they belong in a different body just because they have certain activity and color preferences isn't inclusive. it's regressive.

i doubt you will bother to listen to any stories of people who don't agree with your view points though.

my point is the least possible people should have 'negative' cases with any medical intervention. especially when it involves artificial hormones and amputation.

but negative cases are ok as long as it's someone else's. kids I guess right? 		240514
...
. and i agree. 18 is an arbitrary age for 'adulthood' and has no basis in science. our brains aren't done with adolescence until the age of 25. so why any doctor would encourage a 12 year old to make irreversible medical decisions is beyond me.


ingesting exogenous hormones of any sort (sex, thyroid, sleep) can lull the human body into a state of nonproduction...meaning if you take hormones your body stops making them naturally. even birth control pills have all kinds of horrible side effects. cross sex hormones open up a totally different can of worms. but hey, just let your teenager inject themselves with the stuff because activists claim it helps. instead of getting them real therapy that addresses their distress instead of affirming it. 		240514
...
. https://youtu.be/s96WlMza2f0?si=Cge0LvOl2p4DfSFv 240514
...
dafremen Some little kid grew up in the company of women, coming out too overtly sensitive to be comfortable in the zany, testosterone-soaked world of male aggression and materialistic bummerdom.

But darn it..the girls will only accept other women, children or gay/trans/simpy men.

What's it going to be kiddo? You're too hairy to be cute and lovable anymore. And you're just learning that you were groomed and trained by passive aggressive bigots who were groomed themselves. What a drag. 		240515
...
. or some little girl grew up with unsupervised Internet access and was horrified at all the porn on the internet and what she perceived as expectations on her when her body started to change so she was desperate to stop that from happening. maybe because she was molested when she was younger. maybe because she had a bad sexual experience in early adolescence from a male peer who was already consuming porn.

or like the boy in that video link...clearly gay from a young age in a homophobic community.


once upon a time medical experimentation on children was considered a no fucking go. the guardrails around medical experiments on children were high. but these days supposed liberals have no problem forcing medical experimentation on all of us including kids. and when the results show clear and present danger and harm they all deny it or cover it up with the platitude 'well all medical interventions have some negative results'

say that to the people in their 20s who will never be able to orgasm from being on puberty blockers 		240515
...
phil Try google. The entire internet is at your fingertips if you have such burning questions.

There are going to be resources, like medical websites, where you can go and read what people already said while having a discussion about this topic and learn about it and argue about it there.

With people who have the information.

Don't use blather to get your 5 seconds of attention, and it's not that I am going out of my way to insult or to be controlling. If anybody wants to use blather today, it is like an inbox full of spam. Please, just let us have blather. 		240613
...
. the 'inbox full of spam' was my attempts to bring back good writings from former skites and other topics besides this for the handful of people that are still here

other things to think and talk about

but here you are
bringing this page up AGAIN
after it had long faded from the recent page
to yet again
control the conversation here

so have blather
have a dead recent page
if that is more to your liking
along with
being the moderator 		240613
...
. and good luck finding accurate information on a search engine that has been politically hijacked and loves to censor mal mis and disinformation of their own choosing

good luck finding accurate information from a medical community that has been hijacked by activists who think biology is a social construct 		240613
...
phil "bringing this page up again"

You apparently have more rules for me than the ocean has dicks. 		240613
...
epitome of incomprehensibility I don't want Soma's story to go unnoticed. That was powerful, especially the line "But they say that nobody is perfect (I wish my family was nobody to me), so of course they aren’t."

I guess I prefer fiction to arguments/essays. A story like this can relate to the topic in the title, but wouldn't have to.

Thing is, I also want to talk about the terms "medicalization" and "biology" here (without stepping on anyone's toes or being unfair or annoying, hopefully - so here goes). 		240629
...
e_o_i Okay, so a greater focus on biology in deciding on when/how to treat possible transgender teenagers won't necessarily lead to less medicalization. It seems more likely it would lead to more.

This is a hypothetical, but suppose neurology and neuroimaging advance far enough that it's easy/cost-effective to detect when someone's brain is more like that of the other sex? And that this is a reliable marker of MtF or FtM trans identity?

(I'm using binary terms for ease of reference because this is how human sex *mostly* is, though biology is more complicated.)

And then suppose the medical establishment adopts this as a mandatory screening practice before giving anyone hormones or surgeries, or even puberty blockers?

Wouldn't people who have issues with blanket vaccinations have the same problems with this kind of medical gatekeeping??

I'm not saying that more advanced neuroimaging wouldn't be useful, but combine with this with the current social contagion of transphobia, and that's a recipe for a medical establishment that sets narrow limits on what choices people can make about their bodies. Does that seem fair?

...

But to return to the present and the issue of age. Again, I think the main question should be, "What would be fair?" Yup, I keep using that word, but I think it's important to have a moral core to avoid being guided by what's trendy, "woke" and "anti-woke" alike. (Side note - is "woke" any more meaningful than "skibidi toilet" at this point? I don't know. I'm a geezer. Ask a teen.)

So then the focus would shift on what is best for the individual. Yes, there would have to be guidelines somewhere: let's say, assessment by a few different specialists. In an ideal world. In reality, many of our medical systems are underfunded. You're going to have some doctors who are in too much of a hurry to give a proper assessment, whether that goes the way of giving quick confirmation that someone is trans and a offhand prescription, OR the same offhand diagnosis but the other way around - denying them any services because the doctor doesn't think they're trans, or doesn't think trans people really exist, OR is not allowed to offer them any sort of care because of state/provincial legislation.

None of these possibilities are good. Honestly, the way North American politics are going, I'm more afraid of the last one. But the crucial issue seems to be not that enough money being put into healthcare in the U.S. and Canada, and then poorer or more marginalized people suffer, and people get treated to one-size-fits-all stopgap measures.

As for social contagion.

I agree with that part. I do think that the internet has the effect of amplifying "trending" things - which could convince young people that they're trans when they're not. That's why children should have people that they know and trust in real life, and not just in online spaces. And why everyone should have the opportunity to access communities, online or IRL, that allow for a multiplicity of viewpoints. Etc.

By the same token, "trending" discourse can also convince people to be anti-trans. This can have the effect that kids and teens are afraid to seek advice from people in their social circles because the anti-trans backlash is so widespread. And that can cause the very problem (teens identifying as trans because they're influenced by a closed social circle) that people are claiming they're trying to prevent.

I say "claim" because I don't think everyone is genuinely trying to protect teens. I do think that "." here is sincere, but many online influencer-types aren't. It's not unfounded suspicion; "What about the children?" has been the excuse for a lot of prejudice in the past, and some people are using it as a wedge issue to spread general anti-trans views.

...

I've been super long, but this seems on topic, a little - I just finished watching a video called "The Feminist to Far-Right Pipeline." I was interested, selfishly, when I saw the video maker's from my province. I don't agree with everything she says, but she has some points about how some feminist spaces have been co-opted or compromised by non-feminists using trans issues as leverage. And she isn't a "liberal." Link's at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-CxiPdXuwgc&t=903s

(It's also super long, though - almost 1:15. Must be a Quebec thing!) 		240629
...
notnom the problem is

THEORY ISN'T REALITY


biology isn't a term. it is supposed to be scientific fact.


do you know the difference between autogynephilia and transexualism? do you know the difference between gender dysphoria and body dysmorphia? that autistic people and people with borderline personality disorder can have problems with identity and are easily sheep herded into the trans community when they aren't in fact trans? so yeah, maybe a little gatekeeping is in order in the trans community to make sure people with other mental health problems aren't sucked into a label they don't actually belong in. that is what i mean when i say gender affirming care is a load of crap and not care in any sense of the term. therapists should actually rule out things like autism and bpd before affirming. but that isn't the current order of operations in america. where i live it is actually legal for teachers to hide information from parents if they believe the parents won't 'affirm' a child's gender identity. not all parents who disagree with having 'trans' kids are bigoted right wingers. it is very disingenous to label everyone who doesn't agree with every aspect of gender theory as bigots and right wingers. victims of sexual assault should not have to be retraumatized in a rape crisis center or prison because gender theory says anyone should be able to identify as whatever they want whenever they feel like it and everyone else including the medical community should just affirm them. that is why there is 'anti-trans' backlash. because gender theory is insane. not because feminists are secret far right wingers because they want women only spaces. the vast majority of us don't think trans people shouldn't exist. we just resent being told we are non_men that have to allow penises everywhere including lockerrooms so the feelings of others aren't hurt even if our feelings are hurt. breeding resentment is the fastest way to induce backlash in the rest of society.




i am not a non_man. i do not have a bonus hole. i am not a birthing person or a chest feeder. and i think that transexuals are real and deserve to exist. the anti-trans movement is being created by trans activists coming after kids and erasing women. people who live their lives in theory books and want to dismiss people like me as anti-trans and far right are why we have come to the point that kids are being hurt by this shit.

i mean even lesbians are being attacked as bigots for not wanting penises in their bedrooms. the gender theory has completely gone off the damn rails. forcing the rest of society to follow this ridiculous delusional crap is why there is backlash.

trans health care will be denied to adults that need it because the activists are pushing this shit on kids. politics is a pendulum that swings and when we get too far to one side or the other there is always backlash.


women should not have penises forced upon them in lockerrooms or lesbian bars or female prisons or at rape crisis centers. the 'trans' fixation with taking over women's spaces is why the anti-trans backlash is coming. if these people wanted their own spaces then this wouldn't be a wedge issue. no amount of theory or labels or name calling will make women feel safe around predators. the idea that this is 'far right' is exactly why a right wing backlash is coming all over the western world. the lack of common sense here is exactly what happens when academic theory is imposed en masse to people it doesn't even apply to. the people who talk down to the 'gender critical' are definitely part of the problem. progressives are not progressive at all on trans issues. trans women are trans women. they are different than biological women. they have different issues and needs. forcing us all into the same box isn't progressive. it is what is causing an increase in 'anti-trans' people. the binary thinking from people who claim to be non_binary would be hilarious if it wasn't so fucking divisive.

by the way, there are trans people who do not agree with the medical transition of minors. plenty of them. are they anti-trans?

and also not sure how being against vaccine mandates because of individual physiology and lack of long term saftey data and also being against the medicalization of 'trans kids' basically for the same reasons is inconsistent. i think you misread or mistake most of my arugments about the medical system in general. DO NO HARM was suppposed to be the most important operating principle. we don't let kids do lots of things for that reason. kids are not capable of consent for sex. why should they be capable of consent for sex reassignment?



common sense common decency and respect are missing on all sides these days. anyone who dissents is a bigot. that isn't an arugement. that is propaganda. i should shut up now cause phil really hates when i talk about this cause he doesn't agree with me and will be sure to tell me to shutup and go away for the countless time and then throw a fit when i do just that. 		240630
...
e_o_i I don't know about you vs. phil. I was also trying to say what I think is fair and reasonable - "common sense, common decency and respect" is my goal as well. This isn't a fight.

And I wasn't giving any sharp cut-off dates for when I think people might be old enough to transition because, frankly, I. Don't. Know. I'm not an expert.

I was just pointing out that blanket decisions could cause more harm than help. That was what I was trying to point out with my "what-if" scenario, however clumsily worded.

That's not to say that there shouldn't be age limits. Like, say, it might be reasonable to say people should be adults before undergoing surgery to change any sex characteristics.

The parts that I don't think are fair I don't have time to unpack right now, so I'll end with a self-critique:

I made it sound like polarization just happens because of the internet, and that's not true. I shouldn't have phrased things that way with my talk of "online influencers" or whatnot. You can also have scholarly theory that's disconnected from reality - hell, I did two degrees in English Lit, there's a ton of that. 		240701
...
nr isnt getting involved beyond this "women should not have penises forced upon them in lockerrooms or lesbian bars or female prisons or at rape crisis centers." absolutely agree; anyone who does this is committing assault.

also, people aren't shepherded into the trans community, they personally identify as the gender they do. i don't have enough information to say definitively whether or not gender reassignment surgery is a spontaneous, willy-nilly decision without any screening or planning, but i highly doubt it is, and if it is, it shouldn't be. 		240702
...
notnom it is...people under the age of 18 are given hormones and surgeries regularly now. because they say they are trans. that is all it takes.


autistic and borderline people are convinced they are trans all the time when they actually aren't. i don't just say things like that to say them. i say them to amplify the stories i have heard from people who have been harmed by the current standards. activists skew reality regularly by saying this isn't happening. it is. because people can identify as whatever they want whenever they feel like it and adults aren't allowed to say no because that is bigoted gatekeeping.

watch jordan peterson's interview with chloe cole. it will probably change your opinion of him and the current 'standards of care' around gender.

60-90% of people who are gender dysphoria grow out of it to become GAY.


like i said months ago

don't trans the gay away


(sorry eoi... something i have been attacked about here for about a year now. and the reason i don't shut up about it is because many people think there is screening involved like nr when there definitely isn't. gender affirming care is all about affirming and literally zero about screening) 		240703
...
phil I said that politics are boring.

I don't care about the topic or even politics. My two cents is that surgery is when a person gets cut.

I find it an odd coincidence that this topic was extremely popular a few years back and everything you are saying, I've heard somewhere before.

I find it odd that you aren't so much making great points, as, possibly knowing some of the words involved.

Which is itself not a problem, but you claim this is a passion that you've spent years researching.

You're a fake.

A champion for nobody.

You spent about as much time as a 4 year old who wants a toy (in case you've never seen or heard about this, kids will want something simply because someone else has it, because they're kids exploring the world for the first time, which makes it cute, but when adults do it, it seems pathological and they need help seeing their own behavior as unhealthy for all involved).

You claim liberals are being controlled by fear and will freak out over nothing, while you regularly freebase delusional conspiracy theories.

You claim liberals are control freaks, while your stance places you in the child's exam room deciding what bits are OK for them to snip off and what bits need to stay on. Unless of course the child can prove they are a real not-a-boy.

Assume liberals want children to be happy and want them to have the medical care they need. Then go do the dishes.

. . . .

Look at it this way. We walk into a fish and dildo store. There is a racoon and flamingo at the counter, arguing about winter soltices.

You go to help the racoon win the argument, because flamingos are trash, and you are helping by repeating all of its best arguments.

This continues.

Now some pepsi vendor walks in, seeing the two sides, and wants to even the playing field, by helping the flamingo win the argument. Or maybe they want to trounce the "loser" and join the racoon, making it a 3 on 1.

More strangers appear, joining one side or the other for various reasons. Eventually a great "debate" event is set up between the people's candidate Mr. RACOON and former V.P. D.B. FLAMINGO and this has evolved into full-blown politics; scratching this now only spreads the rash to new holes.

The crowd is swayed and awed by the daimyostic leader's 9th level hand gesture, blown like savory balls into bins of salt, in support of various points.

Their leaders can now collect favors/power/wealth, sweet succor.

Only in this scenario, there are more furries, fisting, and tight hard nipples.

Now, I am the humble dildo store employee and I don't want people arguing at the cash register about child dick.

You see my efforts, to get all of this to stop arguing. You see this as a part of the same argument. It is not. I am not inherently more right or wrong than any of you, I do not have the solution, but I am not debating the point. I am attacking the debate itself and telling you not to have it here. I am not attacking you because of your stance, but because your stance is trash. Both sides. You're all trash.

In defense of trash, you attack me. Think about me. Read me. Be nice to me. Respect me. Show me the same respect that I am showing you. All I did, was try and diddle your bum with my rainbow unicorn dildo choker and you wouldn't even shit on me.

Do you imagine nobody has ever called me boring? Of course they did, and then they got throat kicked.

Now, you have some nice person trying to compromise with your point of view and explain things you got wrong, none of which matters because you are just here to bloat fat racoon shit stains.

Politics are like sports. None of it matters. You're doing it for entertainment. There are some important reasons. Not yours. Others. And all are welcome to speak on personal experience, or have intellectual debates. But again, this is political debate, piles and piles of defecation. Sir! This is a dildo store, look around you. This long-standing establishment of the community does not need the hot heaping stank of political garbage. 		240704
...
nr i didn't know of Chloe Cole, but i researched her after i read this. it seems she tweeted that her doctor did not follow the World Professional Association for Transgender Health's Standards of Care (Los Angeles Blade, 9/11/2022).

if this is true, this is horrible and should not be happening. i looked up the Standards of Care, and there is a section devoted to assessment and treatment, so there is some screening. again, if there isn't enough, then this is something that should be improved upon. it's always helpful to learn more about autism, especially in women, where it tends not to get diagnosed until later in life. learning more about bpd is also a good thing.

better gender-affirming care could prove helpful, and so could better de-transitioning care. but issuing an outright ban isn't the answer. if we're talking anecdotally, i know trans people who transitioned at a fairly young age and after years of unhappiness, finally feel truly like themselves. fewer than 1% of people are shown to regret transitioning -- this post offers some literature on this: https://www.reddit.com/r/asktransgender/comments/145xi13/do_people_regret_transitioning/?rdt=50687. 		240704
...
ego hum When I first blathed "trans teens"
it was a stupid little joke.

Since then you all have broaden my
perspective immensely

Thank you! 		240707
what's it to you? blather
who go from